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supercaffeinated

Lies, damn lies, and nforce2 availability

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Still no retail boards in sight. Nvidia is making liars out of all their reviewers....

...While you still shouldn't expect retail availability for another few weeks, boards are either ready or in the final stages of preparation for mass production.

Hmm maybe that should have read "another few months, not weeks..."

The current schedule calls for shipping to motherboard manufacturers in August, with motherboards shipping in early autumn.

Hmm make that "mid winter" not "early autumn".

Similarly, NVIDIA announced its nForce2 core-logic chipset in mid-July (we wrote up a technology preview at the time), and the company promised retail product availability in August. The month of August came and went, and no products showed up. We didn't hear a peep out of NVIDIA about nForce2's schedule, but the fact of the product delay was obvious....NVIDIA says the nForce2 really, really is coming soon now, too. Now that I've waited as long as I have, I'm going to adopt the consummate Missourian's stance on this one: I'll believe it when I see it. 
At last... someone with a half a grain of sense in their head.

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Supercaff, you are a very impatient man. Didn't you even think to ask them which August?

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Damn, Nforce2 still isn't out yet? I was looking to build a few computers with that chipset this summer for a client of mine, but decided to go with an Intel chipset instead. I thought for sure that it had already been released and everybody had one that wanted one. I guess I haven't missed anything on the nvidia front after all :roll: I'll bet money they are having huge problems with this chipset, and I would definately stay the hell away from it when its released.

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Hmmm. In August my distributor told me mid-November for availability. We'll see what happens.

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Guest russofris

If it's not on www.pricewatch.com, it does not exist.

Zen and the art of PC component procurement.

Frank

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Well, one of the Leadtek boards is now available in Tokyo:

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/akiba/hotli...02/ni_i_m4.html

It uses nForce2 SPP (no VGA) with the full MCP-T southbridge. It also includes a IEEE-1394 card. According to the article, it's only available in low quantities right now (two of the shops listed show it out of stock). More are expected next week... (this week?).

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well this shop in norway got a board :D

http://www.komplett.no/k/ki.asp?action=inf...=5&p=28635&s=fp

The believes they will get the board around the 15 november. Im really looking forward to the nforce 2!

"They got a board...... they will get the board in 2 weeks? Sounds like the same old same old talk to me.

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Well, one of the Leadtek boards is now available in Tokyo:

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/akiba/hotli...02/ni_i_m4.html

It uses nForce2 SPP (no VGA) with the full MCP-T southbridge. It also includes a IEEE-1394 card. According to the article, it's only available in low quantities right now (two of the shops listed show it out of stock). More are expected next week... (this week?).

If it doesn't have the on-board video, it's not worth having IMHO. According to this review of the ASUS board, the chipset's memory bandwidth blows chunks. http://www.amd3d.com/modules.php?name=Revi...howcontent&id=3 . I want the little shuttle box. Where its it?

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:? I thought I read that this chipset although it's fast is VERY unstable. It's benchmarks were very impressive, however if you were planning on running anything other than the processor it would crash and even with just running the processor it would crash.

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:? I thought I read that this chipset although it's fast is VERY unstable. It's benchmarks were very impressive, however if you were planning on running anything other than the processor it would crash and even with just running the processor it would crash.

They call those pre-release boards. Don't pay any mind to them. What few reviews of Officially released boards there are say quite the opposite regarding stability, and performance remains on top.

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I wanted nForce2 for the upgrade I just completed.  I had to make do with a POS VIA KT333.

Yeah, I have the same problem. I had one of the original nForce boards & sold my entire system 3 weeks ago, expecting the nForce2 to hit the streets - WRONG! :evil:

Had all my other kit for weeks; just needed the motherboard. Got p***ed-off waiting for it (as even the non-VGA version won't be available in the UK for another fortnight) & have ended up buying the exact same board I had originally.

I guess when the boards with the IGP finally turn up (i.e. Q1 '03) I'll still buy one, but it's the last time I heed nVidia's press releases (or should I say, paper launches). Next time I want an nVidia product & it isn't out, I ain't waiting; I'll buy the next best thing & then at least I've got something I can use - I've yet to find an expansion slot I can plug a press release into.

I've posted on this forum before about nVidia's alleged release dates & I'm not impressed. What was it the CEO said back in May, "we'll ship the NV30 in August" - yeah, right.

I'm not suggesting they should go ahead & launch a flaky product if there're problems with it (a la VIA), but they should ensure the product is reasonably stable & near "market readiness" before they bandy about release dates.

I can't decide which emotion I feel most strongly: disappointment or disgust.

Autosignature says it all.

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Hmm mid-december is quickly approaching.... I haven't heard of any boards that have the built-in video :(

These boards are pretty much obsolete already. These guys really missed the boat.

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I thought I saw something saying that the integrated video boards won't start shipping in mass until mid Jan.

These boards are pretty much obsolete already. These guys really missed the boat.

Well, I think they are far from obsolete...except maybe in the eyes of bleeding edge enthusiasts. Missed opportunity, yes I agree. If Nvidia had been capble of releasing all variants of the NF2 several months ago they probably would have capitalized quite extensively. But the mobo chipset business is new territory for them. Time will tell whether or not they will become capable of developing and bringing a product to market in a timely fashion. I suspect they will.

Cheers, Ck

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Here's an email I sent to shuttle:

Your announcement on July 15, 2002 of an Nforce2 based XPC http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?IO=IO_20020715_4238 , and your subsequent failure to deliver on that announcement over the last 5 months has substantially tarnished your credibility.

While I appreciate that you haven't delivered on an unstable platform, I will certainly not make future purchasing decisions based on any press release related to your firm.

I currently own one of your XPC SS51Gs, and was looking forward to the Nforce2 based platform as one which did not require a third party video card to be useful for gaming. By the time you release the Nforce2 based system, the video capability on that machine will be substantially more obsolete than it would have been 5 months ago. It is no longer compelling enough for me to consider purchasing. I suggest you cancel your plans to build this PC, and wait for Nvidia's next-generation to become production quality before making future press statements.

Regards,

..................

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No Shuttle XPC based on the nForce2 here neither. However, I could get both Asus boards (A7N8X/A7N8X Deluxe), the MSI and the Chaintech. The one I would prefer to have is the EPoX but it isn't available in my area yet :( The later is supposed to be more stable at higher FSB frequencies and almost on par in benchmarks with the Asus at 166MHz. Not to mention thatit should be as cheap as the MSI too. I have no use for Firewire anyway...

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The only compelling feature of nforce2 is the potential cost savings provided by the decent integrated video IMHO.

It would be inappropriate at this stage to go with plain nforce2 + amd over 845+P4 right now in most cases IMHO.

I'm pretty much set on getting the P4 HT version of the XPC (SB51G). I'm just waiting on the price of the P4HT to come down some more.

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To me the most compelling feature of the nforce2 is that it is not a VIA product. I am sick and tired of b0rken VIA products... and VIA has done little if anything to address their issues. Intel has at least recalled their broken products in the past. I have been very happy with the performance, and most importantly, the compatibility of my nforce2 board. And my SiS 635 and 645 boards have been good, too.

Meanwhile, my EPIA system and several other VIA-based systems are sitting in a trashheap. It's a shame about the EPIA, too. I really liked that system... But it crashed a lot and the ethernet controller rarely worked. The CPU refused to run some code. The USB ports didn't work with my CF reader... etc.

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I agree with you 100%. VIA sucks. I have two boards from them that boot with the mouse locked up. They only work properly after a warm reset. No more VIA chipsets for me. I have also had nothing but nightmares with my TYAN Thunder K7 board. I have the SIS based Shuttle SS51G and it's nearly perfect, except certain features of the bios (press any key to boot from cdrom for example) don't work with USB keyboards.

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Listen, guys, I'm sorry you're having so much trouble with VIA chipsets but I'm running 4 computers here on various VIA platforms starting with an ASUS CUV-4X from 1998, and - aside from the kinds of minor quirks that you find with any computer - they all work as advertised; without stability problems or hassles of any other kind.

Piyono

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I know VIA has produced VIAable products (sorry), but that is not what I have come to expect from them. Ask the Linux kernel hackers too, they know that VIA chipsets generally require very ugly software workarounds to address hardware stability problems. I really want to like VIA. I hope that NVIDIA and SiS keep up the good work, though, because when hammer time comes, VIA might kill an otherwise good product.

VIA cares most about two things (my opinion): 1) Being first to market. 2) Producing the lowest-cost product possible. They often address bugs in later revs of silicon, but it's too late for folks who have already spent their money.

I asked my distributor if a newer rev of the EPIA board might fix my problems, and the answer was "No." Needless to say, I will not even give the new EPIA-M a chance. I switched to the MicroATX form factor and Intel branded motherboards. They're a lot bigger and more expensive, but they have been flawless. And if I had trouble, Intel would back me up. VIA would not care, and I can't say anything about SiS or NVIDIA because I have not needed support on their products yet.

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I know VIA has produced VIAable products (sorry), but that is not what I have come to expect from them.  Ask the Linux kernel hackers too, they know that VIA chipsets generally require very ugly software workarounds to address hardware stability problems.  I really want to like VIA.  I hope that NVIDIA and SiS keep up the good work, though, because when hammer time comes, VIA might kill an otherwise good product.

VIA cares most about two things (my opinion): 1) Being first to market.  2) Producing the lowest-cost product possible.  They often address bugs in later revs of silicon, but it's too late for folks who have already spent their money.

I asked my distributor if a newer rev of the EPIA board might fix my problems, and the answer was "No."  Needless to say, I will not even give the new EPIA-M a chance.  I switched to the MicroATX form factor and Intel branded motherboards.  They're a lot bigger and more expensive, but they have been flawless.  And if I had trouble, Intel would back me up.  VIA would not care, and I can't say anything about SiS or NVIDIA because I have not needed support on their products yet.

AMD will have its own 'chipset' for Hammer. With so much logic intergrated into the CPU there isnt much left out on the motherboard any how, agp/pci bridge and a few other little things... SiS & nVidia also have 'chipsets' being prepared for hammer

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