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etsrad

Micron M600 vs Samsung Pro 850 - advice needed

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Hi, read your articles on the Micron M600 and Samsung Pro 850s....great work! As useful as the information was I am a bit more confused about which drives to get for our servers (looking at getting 2 SuperMicro's STX-NL with the LSI MegaRAID 12Gb/s controller with 1 gb cache). They will be VMWare ESXi servers.

We are considering the M600 1TB vs the Samsung Pro 850 1TB. 16 1TB drives in a Raid 10.

I am concerned about the M600's 1TB note of only a 400TB written and 219GB/day write span....seems kind of low? What is it for the Samsung Pro 1TB?

I am also not sure about the difference between the v-NANDs and the NANDs and the SLCs and the MLCs, and all of that. Which one is better for a simple mix use (database/file/web servers on virtual machines)?
Which actually does have a better lifespan and warranty?

Thanks for your advice in advance.

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Is this for production use test/dev or something else? Do you have any feel for the load applied to the storage?

I understand the cost savings you're trying to work in with the client SSDs, but depending on answers to above, it may make sense to go with an entry-enterprise drive. I'm assuming budget is a concern...

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This article will apply to all of the client SSDs you are looking at, which goes into the advantages of manually increasing over-provisioning of SSDs for more enterprise geared usecases:

http://www.storagereview.com/in_the_lab_giving_client_ssds_an_edge_in_enterprise

This is what we did when we used the 960GB Micron M500 SSDs in our lab environment (Supermicro 24-bay server with the LSI 9361 SAS12 RAID card).

To maybe help focus the discussion a bit, what is your overall price target? Going in that direction, what is your buying market/country? Some drives might be price skewed depending on the area, so that is a good question for most of these topics.

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Production use, usage would be medium-high. Budget is a concern, yes.

Trying to keep it around $19-22k (USA). So far I have 2x2697v3 CPUs, 16x 1TB Micron SSDs (or Samsung Pro 1TB for $2k more), the LSI 12GB/s Raid Controller, 2x16GB DOM for the ESXi installation, an MSI Video card (for GPU, for our applications), 16x16GB memory

Edited by etsrad

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What is the cost per SSD you are seeing right now? I wonder if I might use a channel from our side to help out.

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I'd also lean more toward the M500DC or other entry-enterprise model. They're going to behave better in the environment you're using in most cases. The Toshiba HK3R2 is the cream of the entry-enterprise crop right now but is probably much more expensive. Worth checking with your distributors though to see what pricing you can get.

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Not sure how much the drives are as I am being quoted the server as a whole.....I was thinking of the Intel 3500 but its really pricey, so am unsure what to do....I have read on different forums of people having success with the SSD drives I mentioned.

So if I was to go with the Micron or Samsung, which would you suggest and why?

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Also, how is the M500dc compared to the above drives? How much faster or slower is it? % wise?

Looking at the Micron M600 it can do upto 400TBW while the Samsung is only 150TBW..... so my question is, if the data is spread across 16 drives in Raid 10....does that increase the lifespan of each drive?

And you are right...the Toshiba drives are way too expensive, might as well go with a Dell or HP with their SSD drives at that point

I am also seeing that Dell has some sort of SATA SSD 1.92TB drive....any idea about those?

Edited by etsrad

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It's not as fast, but it's designed for the task at hand where the others aren't. You can OP the client drives and they'll likely be fine, per Kevin's message, but if you can spend a little more for enterprise drives it's worth it. The endurance difference won't likely come into play in any case.

What are you looking at with Dell and HP? They don't make drives, they're reselling someone else's. Dell uses a lot of SanDisk, Toshiba, Micron, etc. Could be any of them.

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Thanks....the endurance for the M500c seems to be 1.9PB, whereas the M600 is 400TB....but as I asked, and if I understand Raid correctly, if the data is split among 16 drives in Raid 10, will the M600 ones still be ok? I also read some latency issues about the M600 vs the Samsung Pro 850...

On Dell's 730xd configuration page there is the below drive...but I can't find any info on it and the Dell support guy wasn't sure about it

1.92TB Solid State Drive SATA Read Intensive MLC 6Gbps 2.5in Hot-plug Drive,3.5in HYB CARR

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As others have said, it's not outright performance that's the concern, but a matter of how consistently the drives will perform under your types of workloads for extended periods-- that's often where client/desktop-marketed drives. Hence in your situation-- especially since this is production-- going with enterprise-marketed may be the way to go.

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What country are you buying these drives in? If its the US maybe we could help you get in contact with a vendor with some strong pricing.

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The Dell drives could be a few things, but it doesn't really matter. You started with looking at a Supermicro chassis, are you switching to Dell now?

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I had to start considering Dell too because there is really no SuperMicro server that has Same business day or even guaranteed NBD warranty....which sucks

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So the next question then...assuming you go with Dell, HP, Lenovo...whomever else for Tier 1 reasons...are you comfortable using your own storage that wouldn't be covered by their warranty? Using your own gives you all the flexibility. The M500DCs for instance are roughly $1/GB from CDW and I'm sure there are discounts to be had for volume.

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Thanks Brian, I did consider that but I read some reports about certain Raid Controllers in Tier1 manufacturers not being able to read some 'client' drives, and also techs upport not supporting the whole system and/or voiding the warranty because the drives are in there in the first place.

Sigh.

Edited by etsrad

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Probably worth calling Dell to understand the warranty. The M500DC is an enterprise drive, not a client drive.

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None. The only SSD brands I'd stick in the server are in the following list (no particular order)

HGST

Intel

Micron

Samsung

Sandisk

Toshiba

OCZ

They need to own IP in the space, either making NAND, making their own controller, or being a huge volume player. Never heard of Edge before.

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Quick update.... after taking everything into consideration along with reading reviews from Anandtech and Techreport, I have decided to go with the Samsung 845DC 800GB....it seems to have a high PBW and solid IOPS, as well as good ready-state IOPS.

Thoughts?

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Yes, the pro.... how does it compare to the Micron M500dc, M600, Samsung Pro 850?

This will be mostly for a mix of file server, web server, mid-use database server.... again 16 drives in Raid10

I am also a bit confused by DWPD....how important is it and is 10 enough?

Edited by etsrad

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The 845DC Pro is probably the best drive in that group you can pick, and has the best endurance... can't really go wrong with it. The only step up would be a really nice SAS drive.

DWPD is basically a measure of how much write activity it can handle. 10 DWPD on those 800GB drives means you can write 8TB to each drive each day for either 3 or 5 years and the drive will keep truckin along. Thats a lot of data ;)

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Ha, it is! Thanks.... The 845DC is a Sata drive? What would be the next step up? Requirement: 800GB minimum.

Raid Controller is a LSI 12Gb/s controller

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